DC 26 Edit

So you're saying it's a good idea to have it so you can use a herd of jumping rats to destroy everything? If they attempt a DC 26 jump check, there's a 5% chance of something catastrophic happening to the surrounding environment, after all.

This is one of the biggest boosts to Summon Monster ever made. It also makes all skillmonkeys useless, as a side note. --Foxwarrior 21:16, November 1, 2010 (UTC)

1- Summon Monster is already one of the great strategist skills, so this doesn't improve it's power THAT much.
2- It's called take 10, which is what anyone should be doing when circumstances are favorable anyway. This only applies on a skill roll, which indicates a rushed attempt anyway. Yes, there is a chance of an auto win on a nat 20, when you are rushing things mistakes are just as likely to happen.
That said, you did make me think of one adjustment that should be made. Thanks for bitching!--Teh Storm 20:39, November 2, 2010 (UTC)
Auto win on a nat 20? So it takes you about 2 minutes to jump far enough to reach another galaxy (although you still have to spend time traveling there). --Foxwarrior 23:08, November 2, 2010 (UTC)
Core D&D Mechanics 101- a natural 20 on a d20 roll always succeeds, a natural 1 on a d20 roll always fails. That said, allowances for reality to slip in have to be made. Like your example with the rats? Maybe they roll a one on a 50 ft jump, and end up tearing out the hand holds, foot holds, and the sides of the chasm as they plummet to their deaths, and damage is dealt to the impact zone.--Teh Storm 17:34, November 3, 2010 (UTC)
Luckily, that rule does not apply to skill checks, or this game would be incredibly stupid. --Foxwarrior 01:44, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
The game already is. Any game where one class of character auto wins compared to all other character types is, by definition, rigged for stupidity. That said, the point you brought up does make this a transformational rule as opposed to a supplemental, which was not my original intention, but oh well. I'll somehow learn to forgive my sel- wait already did.--Teh Storm 05:27, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
Wizards don't automatically win against Monks: it's just that the Monk only has a chance at succeeding in absurdly specific circumstances. Automatically succeeding on a natural 20 with a skill check is incredibly stupid in a completely different way - it's not unbalanced so much as insane. --Foxwarrior 06:49, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
I was talking about Rogues, but point aside.
There is nothing inherently stupid about a auto success on a skill check then there is about auto success on anything else. Nat 20 on a reflex save mean a 2nd lvl Rogue never takes damage from an area effect, even if it came from a Great Red Wyrm. Far stupider than automatically remembering that same wyrm is deathly allergic to onions, in my opinion.--Teh Storm 16:36, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
Nat 20 doesn't mean "always", it means "5% of the time", and a character with only a 5% chance of surviving the exhalations of a powerful being is very unlikely to win the battle. Automatically remembering that the wyrm is deathly allergic to onions doesn't sound bad, but I was thinking more along the lines of Diplomacy: why fight the wyrm when you can get fifty commoners to ask the wyrm to be their friend (as a full round action)? --Foxwarrior 18:41, November 4, 2010 (UTC)
Or collapse the wyrms lair if it is stupid enough to live deep in the earth. Or put wyvern poison in the pockets of those same fifty commoners and offer them as human sacrifice. Or convince the dragon it has contracted a horrible disease and you know the source of the disease is a cursed item in it's hord, and you must take it all away and investigate every piece of it.
If you want balanced social skills try trinity social skills, which goes well with this variant if you apply similar mods to Bluff and Intimidate.--Teh Storm 23:03, November 7, 2010 (UTC)

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