Forum:We're Moving

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Some Starting Information

Yes, we're moving, and soon (well, soon as of 29 September 2010, like, a couple of weeks from now). Why? Well, Wikia's doing this mandatory skin update. For the official blog on that whole deal (and a lot of the reaction), go here: [1]

So, we're moving, to our own virtual server, with a new web address. When the move happens, it should be pretty painless.

Please, voice concerns and questions here. --Ganteka Future 02:18, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Can we be outrageous there? I refuse to move if I can't be outrageous... Also popcorn. I'll ... like ... stand in front of the wiki when the wrecking ball comes to tear it down if there's no popcorn. --Ghostwheel 02:30, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Ah yes, the skin update. I hated it. Unfortuneatly, I'm limited to wikia and won't be able to follow you. Farewell.--May the true lore ever be protected and Kept in the mighty tomes. 17:26, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Details

It's unfortunate that we have to do this, but I hope that we can benefit from it in the end. I want the move to be as fast and painless as possible, so I'd like to implement it in the following way:

• Retrieve database dump of this site.
• Secure hosting, preferably VPS hosting. (Already have a potential provider.) Update DNS records.
• Install necessary software (Lighttpd/Apache, Mediawiki, Postgresql)
• Unzip database dump into new site, support the Monobook and Vector skins (aka old Wikipedia and new Wikipedia). At this point the new site is live.
• Work on rolling out a more lightweight version of Monaco on the new site, possibly change backends in response to live testing (ie if lighttpd proves to be shitty we'll turn on Apache).

We'll see some benefits from the new site -- namely, we can use whatever extensions we want. Editors may find things more convenient. Navigation pages may be significantly enhanced. Users will be very easily able to make printable books out of wiki content (I'm actually pretty excited about that).

Once the database dump is done, the rest of the steps should hopefully take a day at most. Sitenotices and the main page will be edited to direct community members to the new wiki. Notices will be posted on the major Dungeons and Dragons message boards informing the general D&D community that the wiki has moved. Surgo 03:30, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Anticipated issues: random skin incompatibilities, spam. It'll take a bit to get the spam-blocking set up. Surgo 03:54, September 30, 2010 (UTC)

Cost?

So, VPS's are not free (usually; at least not if they're any good), so will the new site be ad-supported, or member-supported? --MidnightLightning☇(talk) 13:10, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

I plan on putting an ad on the bottom of pages to defray costs, but the per-month costs are something I can afford. Surgo 15:46, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Hmmm, well, I may be paranoid, but moving to a new location dependent on one person's pocketbook/generosity might not have the long-term staying power needed. Wikia may be overbearing with this change, but at least they're a large corporation that is likely to stay around (though not if they drive all their users away). So I'll actually stick with Wikia for the time being given that alternative. --MidnightLightning☇(talk) 19:34, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

I think you absolutely are being paranoid, as the cost is only $7.50 a month! Surgo 21:59, October 3, 2010 (UTC)

What's this Moving business?

So yeah, call me a noob, whatever. I still want to know, why we have to move and, most importantly, where? I mean, do I have to change the address or something? Call me a nub, newb, noob, I really don't care. I just want to know what the overall effective changes for the users will be, and I'm talking the hobbyists, not the higher-ups.--Soulblazer 87 19:22, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

The move is being done to retain functionality and formatting that won't be available with the new wikia skin. It hasn't been stated explicitly here, but to my knowledge there are no plans to even attempt to purge this wiki post migration. The licensing allows all the information on here to be copied without permission so long as credit is given, so it's not really a big deal to have two copies floating around. So the move is actually more of a fork, and this wiki will remain up and functional afterward so far as I know (if stripped of a community and lacking significant updates). And that means that if you like the changes wikia is pushing through (fixed page width, altered navigation setups, reduced personal configuration options, etc.) then you don't have to move. There will be changes associated with staying that decrease or eliminate current functionality, however, and I honestly don't know what staying means for hobbyists long term.

The new site won't have a lot of changes for hobbyists, aside from a different internet url. The stated goal is to take what is here and replicate it there, since it works well and just doesn't work with wikia's changes. So if you like this setup and can put in a different address (still TBD, though I expect it by Monday), I think it makes sense to move. There are other long term benefits as well. We can run run whatever extensions (read: power tools) we want, which allows to make navigation more efficient / searchable without also being more complicated and potentially make forms more useful in general. This is a much bigger deal that it sounds like and will very likely make the hobbyists life much easier (by making prettier preloads among other things), but it's really hard to get the impact across without getting technical. Surgo's already said that the new site will have better book making functionality, so if you wanted to compile a dead tree version of your favorite stuff you could do that more easily. There are other benefits as well, but this is getting long so I'm going to leave it at that for now. - TarkisFlux 20:57, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

I see. Good to finally understand what the blazing nine layers of hell was going on. Though, there are things I kinda wonder about still. Since there are going to be two copies, does it mean that what goes up on one, goes up on the other as well? I mean, it's gonna be such a hassle having to put up stuff in both sites. At least I'm not wondering if I was some kind of mental retard, not being able to find the new URL... Good to know really. Thanks for clearing it up.

As separate sites, there won't be any sort of dual updating unless you want to do it manually. While that's probably doable short term if you really wanted to, long term it will get problematic as any changes done there probably won't be duplicated here, and vice versa. There are plans to direct traffic there however, and long term that will be a better place to have your work seen. My advice would be to make the move and not worry about updating here. - TarkisFlux 22:11, October 1, 2010 (UTC)

Hey, sorry to hear you are intending to move. I just want to make it clear that anyone who wants to stay and edit on this wiki is more than welcome to. We absolutely respect your right to choose where you edit, but very much hope you will give the new look a go and see how it fits with your content. -- Sannse (help forum | blog) 21:43, October 6, 2010 (UTC)